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- Well, welcome again to the Straight Truth Podcast.
I'm your host, Josh Philpot, and as always,
I'm joined by Pastor-Teacher Richard Caldwell
from Founders Baptist Church.
Now, we would love to interact with you about this
discussion, so please be sure to leave a comment below.
Now Pastor, almost every sector of culture
right now has been hit with revelations
about long-admired people that have been revealed
to have secret, disgusting lives.
This goes from the top echelon of our government
all the way down to the local pastor.
And in most cases, this means at least
the loss of respect and integrity for these people.
Now, we know that Christians and non-Christians alike
obviously sin, and that's not what we're arguing here,
but what do we really do when it's somebody
that is supposed to be leading, in a certain way, us,
and they're supposed to be leading our people?
So, for instance, in this past couple weeks,
there's been this revelation about the alleged affair
that President Trump has had with Stormy Daniels.
How should the church really respond to something like this?
- Yeah, it's a sad state of affairs, and
unfortunately, as believers, we can't
act as if these things are not happening in our world.
In John chapter 17, Jesus prays for us, for his people.
He doesn't pray that the Lord
would take us out of the world,
but that we'd be kept in the midst of it.
So even though we're a people who are not
of the world, we live in the world,
and as a result, we are aware of
these things that happen in our world or
ask questions about these things that happen in our world,
and we have to think about these things,
how we think about these things is important.
I wanna say something at the outset because
it's important to me because I don't want to be
guilty of something that I think is wrong,
and that is we have a handful of very famous,
visible, accomplished Evangelicals whom I respect,
They're asked questions about these
sorts of things, they give their answers.
I don't think they mean to be spokespeople
for the entire church, but I think sometimes
we treat them like their spokesmen for the entire church,
like one person's response is the
response that we are all to embrace.
And so I just want to make clear
from the outset that I know what I am.
I have a God-given responsibility
to be an under shepherd to one local
congregation on the face of this planet.
That's it, that's my responsibility.
So someone might ask, "Well then,
why do you do a podcast like this,
and why do you answer a question in a public forum?"
And the answer is because I still think it's helpful,
I think this is why other men do so as well,
I think it's helpful for believers
to have someone else think through an issue with them.
Not to represent what their view must be
or where they must land on it,
but just to give an example for how
we think through these kinds of issues
because we all have to think through these kinds of issues.
So I just want to make that clear,
that I'm not speaking, the world is not my parish.
I have a responsibility with Founders Baptist Church,
and so I would encourage people,
ask these same questions to your pastor,
ask these same questions to your elders
because they have responsibility to watch for your soul.
My own thinking is if we're going to
think about these things well,
we have to think about these things in categories.
It's too simplistic when someone walks up to me
and says, "What do you think about the alleged incident
between Stormy Daniels and the President?"
That's too simple a question, or too simplistic a question.
I have to ask, well, from what
vantage point are you asking me this?
Are you asking me about
how such an accusation might reflect
on his claim to be a Christian?
Do we need to think about this at all
in the realm of the genuine fruits of salvation?
Are you asking me about the impact
this might have on a nation when its
chief leader is associated with such things?
That's a different kind of answer.
Are you asking me how I should think about this
as a future voter, as a citizen of the nation?
Should this change the way I think
about voting in the future?
That's another aspect of the question.
So I think there are categories
around which we consider something like this.
So let me just talk about a few of those categories.
One of the things I think we gotta be troubled by, this is
not just related to the President, this is related ...
Athletics,
entertainment industry,
family, our children,
person we're married to.
When we take someone we love or admire
or we've invested something in them emotionally
and we try to argue
for their conversion, for the reality of their salvation,
and we ignore
the biblical statements
about what genuine salvation looks like.
That is a big problem.
We have to understand that we don't
determine what salvation is,
God is the savior,
and the fruits of salvation are
the fruits that he has given voice to in the scriptures.
I don't get to determine what genuine salvation looks like.
The Bible tells me what genuine salvation looks like.
We almost evaluate ourselves by that standard.
And so it doesn't matter whether it's
a wayward child or it is your father or mother
or it's the president of your country.
You have to take a person's lifestyle and measure it against
what scripture says genuine salvation looks like,
and then know whether you need to
pray for their salvation or pray for a believer to repent.
And we can't know that perhaps
finally or with all certainty,
but we still have to be honest with the evidence.
So I don't know the current state of the President's
marriage or family life or anything.
I don't know where he's at today.
What I do know is that
if these sorts of things,
some of which know took place in his past,
so I'm thinking now about his very
public affair with Marla Maples years ago,
if these sorts of things took place
as a pattern and regularly, we know
what the Bible says about that kind of pattern
and the statement it makes about salvation.
It speaks of someone who doesn't know Christ.
Even the President, and now this is not just about
the President, this is about anyone,
when a person's manner of speaking
is consistently filled with profanity,
when their viewpoints are consistently
at odds with the scripture, again,
these are not the things that speak of eternal life.
So I'm a little concerned when we try to Christianize people
instead of just letting them be what they are.
As a Christian, I don't believe that I have to
vote for only Christians when it comes to public office.
If I have the opportunity to do that, that's a blessing.
First Timothy chapter two, I'm gonna pray for those
who are in leadership, I pray for their salvation.
I think first Timothy two, the context is
evangelistic prayer, we're praying for their salvation.
It would be wonderful if we had Christians in all areas of
leadership in our country, and that's just not the case.
So I'm not required to say I can only vote for Christians.
Therefore, I don't feel the necessity
nor should I, very dangerous, to try to
Christianize someone, whether I voted for them or I didn't,
so that's one category of thinking about this.
In terms of what it does to a nation
when our highest leaders are associated with scandal,
I think about Proverbs chapter 14 verse 34.
It says, "Righteousness exalts a nation,
but sin is a reproach to any people."
I like that verse because again,
I think sometimes what we try to do
as United States citizens is we try to make
the United States sort of a new Israel
and the fact is, that's not what
the United States is, it isn't Israel.
We don't live under the Mosaic law.
God's word is not the standard
by which our nation is governed.
It would be wonderful if it were, but it's not.
And so what I would be wrong to do
is to think in terms of the President
as if he is the king of Israel,
and then I take the standards that should have been
applied to the king of Israel and
apply them to the United States President,
and I try to equate those things.
We can't equate them.
But that verse is broader than just the nation of Israel.
That verse that I just read says that
righteousness exalts a nation, any nation,
and sin is a reproach to any people, any nation.
And so though the United States is not Israel,
God is king over the entire Earth,
and when the Creator's law is respected,
then a nation finds blessing there
and when the Creator is
sinned against in a high-handed wave,
rebelled against, rejected,
a nation bears the fruits of that rebellion.
And so our leaders are important
in that not only do they set a trajectory
for where our nation is headed,
they actually are a reflection of where we already are.
It's sad to say, but usually we get the leaders we deserve,
and so when we see immorality characterizing our government
in multiple levels: city level, state level, national level,
what it says is that we're an immoral nation,
and so we're electing people who are in our image.
And I'm not just talking about President Trump.
Again, we try to Christianize leaders,
so I think you can go back as many presidents as you want to
and ask how many of these men were genuinely converted.
I can't say with all certainty,
but I think there's good reasons
to be concerned about a whole host of them.
So we just have to be honest about what we're dealing with.
Leads to a third thought, and that is,
frankly, when it comes to this kind of scandal,
I haven't paid attention to it, in large measure.
My life is not wrapped up on a day-to-day basis
with what's happening in our country politically.
Why? Because though I am an earthly citizen
of the United States of America,
and to that degree, I'm a patriot, I love our country,
I'm thankful for the blessings associated with it,
I'm a citizen of heaven.
This nation is not my final home.
If I take seriously what the scriptures
teach about my place in this world,
I am a pilgrim, I am a stranger, I am an alien,
I am passing through, I'm a missionary.
Before I know it, my life on this side of heaven
will be over, and eternity is before me, and so
I'm not wrapped up in the
day-to-day highs and lows of what's
happening in the country.
I take Romans 13 to heart, which teaches me that
I'm to be a submissive citizen,
I'm to be a model citizen as a believer,
I ought to respect the offices of leadership, even when
I can't respect the personalities who hold the offices,
so I think many Christians are making a mistake right now.
I think some are so outraged by the
behavior of leaders in government that
believers are not being characterized by the kind of
respect and deference to the office
that should characterize Christians.
I think we ought to be models of
giving honor to those where honor is due,
respect to those to whom respect is due,
and in Romans 13, when that's being written,
you're talking about a Roman emperor
whose personality was not respectful.
So it's not about the personality,
it's about the fact that God works through government.
It is like a servant of God, and
I ought to have respect for the offices.
So I take to heart what the scriptures
teach me about citizenship,
and that includes the fact that
this is not my final home, and I think as a
Kingdom citizen, I think as a citizen of heaven,
even as I live my life out as an earthly citizen.
There's much more that could be said, but
just as a word of exhortation, what I would do,
what I would say to my fellow Christians is
think about the categories that relate to the question,
and then realize there are different aspects
of this we have to think about
as we walk through those categories.
So what does the President's behavior ...
Again, I'm not saying this is true or not, this is alleged,
I'm not saying this is his present behavior,
this is apparently something from his past,
even if it is true,
but what I wanna do is think about
what does this kind of behavior say about salvation,
what does this kind of behavior say about our country,
how wrapped up should I be anyway in this
sort of thing on a day-to-day basis.
I think the healthiest thing some of us
could do is just turn off the news
and dive into the word of God and
realize that I've got work to do today
for the sake of the Kingdom of Christ
and I have one ambition in life, second Corinthians 5:9,
whether in the body or standing before Jesus
face-to-face, to be well-pleasing to him.
That's my ambition, and so what happened between
anyone and someone else really doesn't relate
too much to what my calling is today,
and so I wanna be wrapped up in those things
that the Lord wants me to be wrapped up in, and
final thing I'll say, it's a good opportunity
for all of us to examine our own, personal integrity,
and so if we really believe this is hateful to God,
then it's hateful not just in another person,
it would be hateful to God in my life,
and so I want to be sure to watch for my own
purity and fidelity, I want to be faithful to my wife,
beginning at the most fundamental places,
my mind and my heart, and wherever in our lives
that is not quite as it ought to be,
then let us repent of our sin,
make sure we examine ourselves
before we examine everyone else.
- Thanks for joining us once again
for the Straight Truth Podcast.
Now, be sure to like, subscribe, and share this podcast
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Now, Straight Truth is a production of
Walking in Grace Ministries, which is the
preaching and writing ministry of Pastor Richard Caldwell.
So be sure to go to our website,
straighttruth.net, for more info,
and be sure to leave a comment or a question for us there.
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